모멘텀 에피소드 14:
Gene Marks가 있는 중소기업을 위한 소프트웨어 솔루션

As a small business, are you lost trying to figure out what software solution to use with more choices than ever? Sometimes it feels like you need a dedicated business solutions expert to even help narrow it down. Thankfully, that's exactly who we have on the show today.

Welcome to Momentum, a podcast by Jform where we talk about technology, productivity tips, insights, and best practices that help us move forward in business and in life. Today, we'll be talking to Gene Marks.

All right, so this is Elliott, your host, and today I'm here with someone you may have seen collaborate with us before. So it's great to finally have you on the Jform podcast today. Gene, welcome to the show.

Thank you very much for having me on, Elliott. I appreciate it.

All right, so you have a lot of potential titles. I'm looking at a few here, you know, from small business owner, author of five management books, columnist, you've been published in the New York Times, Washington Post, and you have your very own Forbes column. You've also appeared on MSNBC and the Wharton Business Channel. But let's go back to how you got started on this journey and maybe provide just a little bit of background for our listeners who might not be as familiar with you.

Sure, yeah, that's fine. I mean, first of all, I guess we're not doing this on video because if anybody can actually watch me right now, you would know right away when I say that I'm a CPA. Just a heads up, some authenticity for those of you guys actually watching this. Big spoiler alert, I'm a CPA. That's how I started out.

Then I started my business way back in 1994, which is like, I'm thinking about, like, I think Clinton was president. But anyway, for the past however many years, we do technology consulting and we specialize really in CRM, customer relationship management applications. A lot of the applications that we implement are for small and medium-sized businesses across the whole spectrum of different types of small and mid-sized business applications.

Like you mentioned earlier, I do write in a lot of different places, specifically for this conversation, I write six times a month for Forbes on technology and CRM. I do it for selfish reasons mainly so I can stay ahead of the tech that impacts my business and my clients, and then I can share it with whoever wants to read about it in Forbes or talk about it like we're going to do today.

Absolutely. So obviously, you know, kind of as a thought leader in that space, you're uniquely qualified to today's topic. I figured we'd leverage that expertise and pick your brain a little bit just on the top software solutions you're currently recommending for small businesses. Obviously, there are a lot of different needs out there. Each business is unique, but for the majority of our Jform users who operate in the small business landscape, which is a lot of our users, I'm willing to bet there's still plenty of common ground and overlap we could cover just with sort of a consolidated list of what you would recommend coming from your position and expertise. So may I give you the floor? I'm excited to hear what your thoughts are.

We could pick an industry or sector first. Maybe we start with CRM, you know, your dessert.

Yeah, I mean, there's, you know, I do sell CRM solutions, so it is sort of our bread and butter and what I love talking about. But CRM is just one of the categories of software that any small business should have. We'll cover a few of them, but we'll start with CRM. It is a giant market, like an 80 billion dollar market. Ninety-one percent of companies with more than 11 employees now use CRM software, and a lot of smaller companies than that also use CRM software as well.

Not to insult anybody's intelligence, CRM is customer relationship management. It's always good to spell it out. Some of the big players that are out there, people recognize Salesforce, Microsoft Dynamics, Zoho, Sugar, Nimble, Insightly, Copper. There's a bunch of great mainstream CRM applications that small businesses can get for a very affordable price.

Of course, if you're listening to this or maybe even watching this, you're asking yourself, what can I use the CRM system for? Let me just tell you the three big benefits of a CRM system. Number one, it's a database. Nothing falls through the cracks with a good CRM system. If you are doing it the right way, you've got everybody that touches your business in your database — vendors, suppliers, customers, prospects, your mom, your dad, your cousin, your bookie, whoever. They're all in there if they're touching you.

You've got follow-ups, which means you're following up on deals, sales, service, marketing. Everybody has some type of reminder or follow-up in there, so nobody falls through the cracks. No quotes fall through the cracks, no service issues fall through the cracks. That's one of the biggest advantages of having a good CRM system.

Second, everybody's on the same page, which is a more diplomatic way of saying nobody in your company looks like a dope. Whoever contacts anybody from your company can see who else has been talking to that person, the emails that have been sent, any prior activities, notes, or information about them. Maybe this person bought a certain product from somebody in your company or they're a certain type of company or they're a Mets fan, unfortunately, or maybe their kids are getting out of prison. Real-time alignment.

Yeah, everybody's on the same page. That's the second big benefit of a CRM system.

The third, as we all get older and the average age of the small business owner gets older, having a good CRM system helps build intangible value in your business that you can sell one day when you want to exit out of your business. People want to buy data, and if your data is good, a CRM system will do that for you.

There are many good platforms out there. I mentioned a few again — Salesforce, Dynamics, Zoho, Copper, Insightly, Nimble. Those are some examples. You can Google them and their competitors. I can tell you right now, you pick anyone if it's implemented the right way, it should be a huge value to your business.

That's the first big thing businesses should have. Some are structured more towards large-scale enterprise clients, and some are structured more for the little guy, or they all kind of a one size fits all depending on your plan.

It's a great question because even the big players say they're good for small businesses too, and they're really not. To answer your question, products like Salesforce, Dynamics, Oracle, SAP are great, but I tend to push them more towards enterprise or larger customers. There's a bunch of affordable CRMs like Zoho, Nimble, Copper, Insightly, Sugar that are more geared towards smaller-sized businesses.

Whenever I talk to a prospective client for CRM, I always ask how many users they're going to have. If they tell me five, I can kind of push them in that direction. There's no reason to buy a school bus if it's just you and your spouse. Why have overkill? So yes, there are CRMs targeted depending on the size of your company.

There's maybe a misconception that CRMs are strictly for sales, but you made a good point that CRMs cover any touch point with your company, any contact, whether you're providing a service or getting a service. It's all stored there. Regardless of your industry, it's something you should consider if you have any sort of business, no matter how small or what type of business it is. You will benefit from the CRM.

It's not just customers or prospects; it's your vendors, suppliers, partners, employees, and anybody that touches your business. Whoever your company is dealing with, those contacts should be in your CRM system.

On top of that, all this data that the CRM system collects, pretty much every single platform out there can integrate that data with other software applications, other solutions, other workflows. It's just part of the workflow, but it's almost kind of the home base for your data, and then you can use it how you want.

Just throwing this out there, this is the Jform podcast, so I don't work for Jform, no obligation to mention them, but I do have a lot of clients that use Jform and integrate with those CRM systems. A common use I see is web forms — somebody does a survey, webinar, or event and creates a form on Jform where people can sign up. There's a lot of out-of-the-box integration, so it goes right into your CRM system because it integrates with a wide variety of them. That's not uncommon and very legitimate.

I appreciate the plug. We didn't pay you to say it, but we'll always take it.

That's key for our customers because people who use Jform usually don't operate in a silo. It's usually in alignment, conjunction, and coordination with some other software tools. Many companies have CRMs or are onboarding CRMs, and it's one of our most popular integrations at this point. I'm sure a lot of similar companies would say something similar. CRMs are absolutely pivotal.

May we switch category a little bit? Talk about another thing any company needs no matter their size — an HR software solution. Especially as companies have become more remote, it's even more important to have it on the web somewhere. We're past the days of having a couple people in a small cubicle office with one HR manager. People have to be autonomous and manage a network now, even for small companies. Maybe you could speak a little bit to some HR solutions you like and why companies need it now.

Sure. Paychex, ADP, BambooHR, Gusto, Zenefits, Paycor — those are some of the platforms out there. Here's how it's changed though. I never thought people would move to the cloud with their accounting systems because small business owners were the most cynical and distrusting people in the world. Yet everybody's flying to the cloud.

I thought the same with HR systems — who's going to put their HR data on the cloud? They're never going to do that. Of course, everybody is. Now what I'm seeing is a proliferation of cloud-based HR applications being adopted quickly by many small and mid-sized companies. They all integrate with your payroll system.

Everybody in your company gets a mobile app. If they need to check their payroll, they just look it up in the app. If they need to put in PTO, vacation, or sick time, they do it through the app. If they need to update contact information, health insurance policies, or 401k selections, they do that too.

The mobile apps also come with modules to do performance reviews. We all do great jobs as business owners with performance reviews — we're all up to speed and up to date, right? Employees never complain they don't get enough feedback. These applications help facilitate that so employees and supervisors can take notes on projects and jobs in real time. They come with alerts, reminders, and workflows to schedule and complete face-to-face meetings and review notes.

Employees push down the work to themselves, giving them more control and power over their HR universe. Employees love it because it shows you're operating a business in 2022, not 1922.

Most importantly, it's cutting back on overhead and increasing productivity. Many older school clients have someone in the office doing all this stuff manually — going through forms, answering questions, dealing with payroll problems. This can be done by employees themselves, cutting back or even eliminating that human role. That's what technology is doing — replacing people but enabling new opportunities and efficiencies so the company can continue to expand.

Even five or six years ago, I was still getting a paper check. It's remarkable how fast times have changed. Everything's integrated now on a good HR server — pay stubs, payroll, sick time, company policies, jury duty, holidays, equipment logs, birthdays, work anniversaries, fun facts about coworkers. It's a good way to understand where you work and the people you work with, especially if you're new to a company.

Wait, I'm confused. You work for Jform, right? You don't work for Paychex or Zenefits?

No, I don't. I just use BambooHR to help remind myself of important dates and things. It's really helpful to get oriented to a company's structure and people without having to knock on the HR manager's door.

Couldn't agree more. If you're hired by Jform and they're still doing payroll the old-school way, like five years ago, with paper checks and manual vacation requests, that's like the 19th century. It has an impact on the workforce.

The paper check company I used to work at transitioned to an online HR system by the time I left, but it was a rough haul. I was glad to go to a tech company where we automate this stuff and make life easier for everybody.

That's HR. We've covered the significance and some tools. Is there one you'd specifically recommend for small businesses, or are they all pretty much the same?

I can't recommend any one tool because they're all really good. Different businesses have different needs and sizes. None of the tools I mentioned — Paychex, ADP, Paycor, BambooHR, Zenefits, Gusto — are industry specific. You don't need a special HR system for retail or manufacturing. Plenty of competitors are out there. Start with your own HR payroll service company. I hope you have one. See what they provide because if they're worth their salt, they've got applications available for you.

Great advice. Moving on to another category, data management and files and servers. Companies have to deal with large quantities of data regardless of where it's coming from. Everything is now stored in the cloud. It's great to have physical copies, but you need it online and accessible. Even small businesses need to store large amounts of data depending on their sector or industry. Do you have any recommendations for that category and why companies need that instead of old-school storage solutions?

Doesn't it amaze you how much garbage you generate at home? I live in a one-bedroom and barely move, yet we generate a lot of garbage. It's the same with data. We generate gigabytes of data all the time with photos, documents, videos, core data in accounting, CRM, collaboration systems. Even the smallest businesses do that, so they have to have a system for managing their data.

My smartest clients don't have data anymore. There's no more servers or Windows. They have their devices and network, but everything is stored outside their office in the cloud. Even if they have an old-school system like QuickBooks Desktop or FileMaker, they host it outside. You should store your files with managed service providers.

One I recommend is Right Networks. They're excellent, based in New Hampshire, publicly held. They host QuickBooks and other data. They're the only game in town. You can Google competitors, but they host all data, make sure everyone can connect, support connections, and ensure data is backed up and secured. Is it 100% secure? No, nobody can guarantee that, but companies like Jform and Right Networks have the security, smart people, and best tools to make data as secure as possible.

Managed service providers' whole business model is built around making sure people's data doesn't get hacked. If it did, they'd be out of business. They have way more resources and motivation to keep your data safe so you can stay in business. It doesn't eliminate risk but minimizes it.

Some people use other services like Dropbox. In my company, we have QuickBooks hosted by Right Networks, a CRM system like Zoho for projects, and files saved sometimes with Right Networks and sometimes Dropbox. Our files are synchronized with Dropbox as a fail-safe, which is hugely important. That way, if something happens, you can restore from a separate source.

It's hugely important to go with an established company because hosting data is one of the easiest things to do if you're starting up, but to do it securely and well can be trickier. Any company that says your data is 100% safe is lying. But companies with proven track records and resources to protect your data are the ones you want on your side. Don't fall for phishing scams or free data storage offers.

Many IT firms have pivoted to the cloud. You might still work with a local IT firm that says they're hosting your data, but in all likelihood, they're hosting it on Amazon Web Services, Google Cloud, or Microsoft Azure. Those platforms are more established, supported, and secure. You can still get support from your local IT company, but make sure they're competent and know what they're doing.

We had a data breach because we didn't check all the boxes on Amazon Web Services and got hacked. Luckily, it was just test data. You have to question your IT firm to make sure they're doing the right stuff.

Don't be afraid to ask the obvious or stupid questions to make sure your data is secure and challenge the people guarding it. Many small business owners fall prone to letting experts handle it without questioning. I encourage all to ask questions regardless of your tech proficiency.

Great advice. Our support forums are full of those questions. Jform users are very much on top of that.

The next category is a bulkier one: overall productivity and collaboration platforms. This brings up TV shows on Netflix and Amazon, but listeners who want advice and technology solutions would love that. Productivity platforms are important even for small businesses because many people work from home and are autonomous. You probably have people working independently instead of collaborating in person. Even smaller businesses need collaboration and productivity tools to get aligned on projects.

There are obvious choices like Microsoft Office 365 or Microsoft 365, Google's G Suite, Box, Slack, which are great collaboration platforms. These vendors want you to pick their platforms and live within them, which is fine. They integrate well with file and data management and workflow applications like Jotform.

My advice is to sign up for these things. Even though it's 2022, we're still doing Word docs and spreadsheets like 30 years ago. You need to do that as well as have online meetings, chats, and email communication. If you have Microsoft Office, you're probably using only 20% of what it does. I have Office Professional and constantly find features I don't use, like air conditioning in a car I don't know how to turn on.

Get some training. Invest in somebody to teach you and your workers what you own. Microsoft Office has real-time translation in Skype and Teams. You could talk and have this conversation translated into Mandarin for Chinese viewers. They have multi-factor authentication and security features to protect documents.

Microsoft Teams has a walkie-talkie function on smartphones, which clients love because they can walk around and talk easily with one button. These are just examples of features you probably don't know you have in your collaboration system.

They're all good, but get training. The tech behemoths add many features to be your one-stop shop. It can be overwhelming, and many people don't know the capabilities in their G Suite or Microsoft portfolio.

You can find training through vendors like Microsoft, Slack, Google, or on LinkedIn. Consultants cost $50 to $200 an hour. They might spend five to ten hours training you and your team, which is well worth it to get more productivity out of what you already own.

For project management, leaders include Asana, Basecamp, Trello, Monday, Microsoft Project, and Zoho Projects. They're designed for small businesses and are affordable. You might need some training, but project management software could be your core business application besides accounting.

If you're a QuickBooks user, Intuit has a marketplace with hundreds of applications that integrate with QuickBooks, including project management software. Even if you're not a QuickBooks user, it's a great place to start evaluating what you want.

As a CPA, accounting software is your bread and butter, your dessert, but probably your favorite dessert. You obviously like Intuit and QuickBooks. Can you speak to why it's pivotal for businesses of any size to be on board with something like this and what people might look for in different solutions?

Sure. It's my least favorite application. I'm a CPA but the world's worst CPA. If it's close enough, it's good enough, which is not your dessert but celery juice. We used to sell accounting software before CRM days, and I just hated it. CRM is more exciting because it's sales and marketing.

But it's very important to get an accounting software, especially cloud-based, so you can access it from anywhere, get reports online, and have remote employees do the work. If you don't have a cloud-based system, have it hosted by a managed service provider like Right Networks.

Leaders in accounting software for small businesses include Invoice2Go, FreshBooks, Wave, Xero, and QuickBooks. They integrate with Jform and many other applications. One person can do billing in Seattle, another pay checks in Miami, and you can get reports in St. Louis. Cloud-based is a big deal.

Involve your accountant in the process, not because they know software, but to find what they're comfortable using. If your accountant says they use QuickBooks, use it to make life easier for them. More accountants are becoming fluid in software and technology, which is a boon.

Moving on, another thing small businesses need is a secure way to collect data, signatures, contracts, and legal documents. Jform is a solution for a lot of that, but there are others. As we go into remote work, everyone needs an online way to do this. You can't always have someone sign a physical paper anymore.

The leader in this field is DocuSign, the most well-known brand, but there are others like Adobe Sign, Zoho Sign, and Jform's options. These have become very accepted for signatures. Depending on your industry, it's vital to have this. We use it all the time for quotes and anything needing a signature.

It takes time to learn how to use these, set up fields, and have data come back into your system. Jform's options are excellent and probably one of the more affordable choices. DocuSign requires rigorous training for complex use cases, but Jform is a bit more intuitive and easier to use depending on your needs.

There's a difference between electronic and digital signatures. Digital signatures have more verification and hold up better legally. DocuSign can do either or both. We have a video on this topic.

We've covered many important topics and solutions small businesses need. Is there anything we've left out that most small businesses might need in their tech portfolio?

Security. With the explosion of people working from home, there's been a correlated explosion of ransomware attacks. We're all just dopey people working from home, sharing PCs with kids, downloading nonsense. The number one reason companies get hacked is employees clicking on wrong emails or falling victim to phishing.

You have to have good security. Talk to your IT firm and hire them to provide quarterly training for employees, especially those working from home, so they can recognize scams. Invest in security software like KnowBe4, which automatically trains employees on scams and alerts if they fall for one.

Upgrade your operating systems because hackers look for low-hanging fruit. Older systems get hacked quickly. Your IT firm should also check home users' routers and reconfigure them because most routers are insecure with default passwords. Having a VPN at home is very important.

Security is really important with the rise of working from home. Business owners must invest to avoid hacks and get cyber insurance just in case. Phishing scams are everywhere, even texts from your own number or emails from your CEO asking for urgent calls. Always be cautious and don't share private information in emails.

Gene, that sums up our topic and time today unless there's anything else you think we missed.

I think we covered a lot of good ground. I definitely learned a lot on this episode. Your expertise speaks for itself — your bread, butter, dessert, and celery juice depending on how you look at it. It's been great to have you on the show today and appreciate what you brought.

Thanks for having me on, Elliott. I appreciate it.

We will have links to what we talked about today in the description if you watch this on YouTube. Otherwise, you'll most likely see Gene Marks again on our channel. He knows his stuff when it comes to small business and software solutions. I hope you've learned as much as I have today. Thank you very much, Gene, and we'll see you another time.

Look forward to it. All right, take care.